Obamacare in prespective

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11 years 2 weeks ago #32913 by magi
Replied by magi on topic Obamacare in prespective

jtallen83 wrote: But did they really want to? I'm thinking this was the plan all along, destroy an already corrupt system and then when everyone cries uncle replace it with what they wanted in the first place, a true socialist based medical system.
It also serves the purpose of inoculating the public to the idea that the executive branch can change the law by decree. They create the crisis then look for praise from the public by "saving" them from it with unilateral changes to the law.
Like all attempts at socialist and national fascist governments this can only end with misery and death for millions.
God save us all :pray:


This is such an honestly fascinating.. paranoid.. Conspiratorial notion.... I really love it........

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11 years 2 weeks ago #32916 by OleCowboy
Replied by OleCowboy on topic Obamacare in prespective
I am on Medicare for some, but my real health is from the VA I am a 100% disabled from combat. So I see both systems.

Medicare is not cost effective due to the massive amount of waste and fraud. If you factor in the over admin costs that it takes the govt to run.

Best system I have ever seen is the Mayo clinic. Well run, patient focused and should be a model for healthcare. Mayo stopped taking medicare, why, rates too low. Well that is the govt rationing healthcare.

Again, the govt has ZERO interest in your healthcare, what they want is your money and total control over you. This is called socialism.

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11 years 2 weeks ago #32925 by Libertarian623
Replied by Libertarian623 on topic Obamacare in prespective
Cowboy- #1 You should not compare VA to medicare, they have two entirely different objectives. VA is and never will be cost effective, at least I hope not. So that's a unfair comparison.
#2 Saying medicare is not cost effective because of fraud is again a unfair argument. So because a bunch of criminals ( some doctors ,lawyers, insurance companies) are robbing the system its the systems fault. How about lets round them up and put them in jail and take the money back.

#3 You got part of that right the best marketed system in healthcare is the Mayo clinic, but if you base it on fair outcomes in a double blind study they would come out in the middle of the pack. Glad its not the model by which others are measured. Since they stopped taking medicare that eliminates about 80 percent of the market. This just leaves the cream on the top to be billed excessively. Sounds good we will see how that works for them over the long term. Do what you want its a free market but in the long run they will not be able to maintain this strategy.

#4 Again I agree with you the government does not have a interest in your healthcare. If you could reach back and rescind all the government dollars spent invisibly (research, educational grants, building grants, infrastructure) I am cool with saying its a free market and let it fly. I wish we had a system like that, no one does though. But after reaping the benefits of the governmental dollars (taxpayer dollars) for years its time for insurance companies and hospitals and pharmaceutical companies to pay off some of the interest that has accrued. I honestly think the way the system was going it was going to trigger a collapse of the system, I was unwilling to see that happen, healthcare was to important to let corporate greed take over and run it into the ground. When corporations get large enough to affect large groups of peoples lives in a negative way so they can profit they aren't much better than a war criminal or a foreign country. I see this as a way to combat that and ensure that everyone benefits from the trillions of taxpayer dollars spent to build the system that exists. Corporate America is our biggest threat to freedom ( they currently control large portions of our government), I say we due away with the blameless corporations ( you can't sue them and win) and replace it with personal accountability. When CFO's CEO's are responsible for there corporate decisions we will be closer to my ideal freedom. Right now big government is on the back burner for me. Right now I see us closer to being victims than socialists. Either that or suspend all laws and have a free for all either way I'm good.

WOW that was a total rant wasn't it, very complex questions. Wish I had more answers.

A toast to this forum and its members.

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11 years 2 weeks ago #32927 by OleCowboy
Replied by OleCowboy on topic Obamacare in prespective
Lib, I am not comparing Medicare to the VA. What I am saying is that the govt goal is single payer, govt docs and facilities, the RESULTS will be a VA, long wait times, over burdened and understaffed

A prime reason why fraud and abuse is so prevalent in all govt programs is that when caught at best its a slap on the hand. Steal a $100 Million, get 3 years on probation and if you do serve any time its at country club prisons. The fed CC prisons allow you to come and go, its basically apartment living with cable TV, and unlimited visiting.

How often does anyone serve serious time? How often does any govt employee get fired? The answer is almost never on both counts.

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11 years 2 weeks ago #32932 by jtallen83
Replied by jtallen83 on topic Obamacare in prespective
Medicare would be inefficient without any fraud! 13 times in one year they they changed the status of my secondary insurer to primary, all based on an erroneous entry by the same hospital on the same bill. 5 times I had to get the lawyer for my wife's employer to write a letter explaining why they were secondary and not primary. During this time they rejected every bill sent that had the correct information. I would spend literally hours on the phone getting things straight only to have them foul it up again. This caused my Doctors office untold hours of filling out the same forms over and over, it was almost 2 years from the date the service was provided before they got paid. The whole thing needs to be trashed and replaced with .......well, nothing. The federal government has no business involving itself in my health care, my retirement, or anything else besides protecting me from foreign intervention!
Liberty First :usa:

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11 years 2 weeks ago #32941 by magi
Replied by magi on topic Obamacare in prespective

OleCowboy wrote: During the 3-1/2 years of World War 2 that started with the Japanese bombing of Pearl Harbor in December 1941 and ended with the Surrender of Germany and Japan in 1945, the U.S. produced 22 aircraft carriers, 8 battleships, 48 cruisers, 349 destroyers, 420 destroyer escorts, 203 submarines, 34 million tons of merchant ships, 100,000 fighter aircraft, 98,000 bombers, 24,000 transport aircraft, 58,000 training aircraft, 93,000 tanks, 257,000 artillery pieces, 105,000 mortars, 3,000,000 machine guns, and 2,500,000 military trucks.

We put 16.1 million men in uniform in the various armed services, invaded Africa, invaded Sicily and Italy, won the battle for the Atlantic, planned and executed D-Day, marched across the Pacific and Europe, developed the atomic bomb and ultimately conquered Japan and Germany.

It's worth noting, that during the almost exact amount of time, the Obama administration couldn't build a functioning web site.


This has been well received on my Facebook page Cowboy.......

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11 years 2 weeks ago #32943 by OleCowboy
Replied by OleCowboy on topic Obamacare in prespective

magi wrote:

OleCowboy wrote: During the 3-1/2 years of World War 2 that started with the Japanese bombing of Pearl Harbor in December 1941 and ended with the Surrender of Germany and Japan in 1945, the U.S. produced 22 aircraft carriers, 8 battleships, 48 cruisers, 349 destroyers, 420 destroyer escorts, 203 submarines, 34 million tons of merchant ships, 100,000 fighter aircraft, 98,000 bombers, 24,000 transport aircraft, 58,000 training aircraft, 93,000 tanks, 257,000 artillery pieces, 105,000 mortars, 3,000,000 machine guns, and 2,500,000 military trucks.

We put 16.1 million men in uniform in the various armed services, invaded Africa, invaded Sicily and Italy, won the battle for the Atlantic, planned and executed D-Day, marched across the Pacific and Europe, developed the atomic bomb and ultimately conquered Japan and Germany.

It's worth noting, that during the almost exact amount of time, the Obama administration couldn't build a functioning web site.


This has been well received on my Facebook page Cowboy.......

Thanks I was just passing it on and please continue to do so...

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