to bring everybody up to speed... long read

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10 years 8 months ago #35056 by mrraley
to bring everybody up to speed... long read was created by mrraley
Here it goes... :dry:

In November, I was told ArmaLite was no longer going to be teaching the Armorers courses.

As December rolled around, I was finishing up the lest of my courses and making sure I did not leave any of my information on the company server.

As I was doing a search, I had found the one of the PM's had saved a copy of my course on the server in a protected folder that I could see and look at but had no administrator privileges, so I could not do anything about the file. I went to the gentleman that had put it there and asked him to delete my file especially since ArmaLite was no longer going to be offering the Armorers courses any longer. After the file was deleted, I was called into the HR's office and asked why.

A few hours later, I am being told that they have to let me go, and this is why.

(A) It has been brought to our attention, that you had a file deleted of the main server.We have contacted the new management and have been instructed by them, that if the three of us are in agreement, we are to let you go. (one of the three was not in agreement) Majority rules, and you are being terminated for conspiring corporate sabotage. Do you have any questions?

(Me) Asking for explanation, on how what I did was considered corporate sabotage.

(A) You had file deleted off the main server that yo didn't have access to.

(me) Correct, it was a course I developed while I was in Afghanistan, I expanded it while working here, put ArmaLites name on it to make ArmaLite money, only used two pictures directly from ArmaLite, and used technical information that ArmaLite has as public information directly for down load. So nothing is secret, except on how I teach it.

(A) You can file an appeal and we will review it.

(Me) I fie an appeal.

(A) You may not see it as sabotage but the whole matter had an air of deceit about it that makes us wary about giving you further access to our data. We are trying to escalate the professionalism of the entire staff and this type of behavior will not get us to where we want to go in that regard.

Note: (and all of this is coming from a man that wiped out half the sales orders in one month along with customer accounts that we had to researched again, called, and reload because of him, but he calls my action deceit)

So that puts me where I am at currently. Figured I needed to explain why I haven't been around much, and that is because I needed to make cuts of my own and internet access is one of them being limited. So I am still on the search for another job now.

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10 years 8 months ago #35058 by OleCowboy
Replied by OleCowboy on topic to bring everybody up to speed... long read
Mr M, am saddened to hear of this and to hear of your parting. You are an asset anywhere you go and if you need anything I will do my best to support you.

My best advice here is to move on, look back on the good, forget the bad. As for the course, based upon what you have said, its pretty much theirs in spite of the fact you developed it. Since you were in the Army on AD at the time then in fact its generally considered as "public domain" unless its classified. My office spent millions developing software, developing training and tons of stuff that has been handed over to companies which often put their name on it and sell it and services along with it.

This is what happens so often when a big company buy's a small one. They start slashing functions and as a result jobs. Sometimes it makes sense, sometimes it does not and only time will tell how ArmaLite becomes a new ArmaLite. Nor do we know the motives of the company that bought them. Was it to reduce costs and then put AR back on the market and make a tidy profit for themselves...who knows.

I wish you well and am sure all will be better soon... :twothumbs:

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10 years 8 months ago #35061 by Libertarian623
Replied by Libertarian623 on topic to bring everybody up to speed... long read
Mr. Raley- If the course was yours and yours alone(see employment agreements) you can protect this as intellectual property. You have more credibility along these lines if you have teaching credentials. If not you still may protect them if you have a good paper trail. Either way depends on how serious you are . You will need to get the right layer for the job and be prepared for a extended battle. Or you can ask for credit for your work (ie your name on it when ever it is presented) Most instructors settle for this, its all you really want is recognition for the hard work you put into something. I don't know the extent of what you created or the time and resources involved, that said I wish you luck. Just because something is not as tangible as say a piece of steel doesn't mean that is not of value and there is no protection for its creator from exploitation, just as a patent protects a inventor.
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10 years 8 months ago #35064 by Libertarian623
Replied by Libertarian623 on topic to bring everybody up to speed... long read
Just ask Bill Gates , he took on IBM for DOS and won. He did this as a 18 yo if memory serves me correctly

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10 years 8 months ago #35065 by Siscowet
Replied by Siscowet on topic to bring everybody up to speed... long read
Mrraley. First I am sorry to hear this. Just the time you have put into forums to answer questions and help out with problems tells me that you are the type of employee who should be valued, but that is not the corporate model in too many of our companies.. That said, it all depends on what your employment agreement says about proprietary intellectual ownership. You will need a good attorney to give you an overview of your chance of success. If you have a copy of the employment agreement, read it thourgholy. Also if you have any paper trail from your time in Afghanistan, e-mails, etc., showing that the program was developed previous to your employ, so much the better. Suggestion; your next position, have this issue resolved in writing before you sign hiring papers. Generally, unless otherwise stated, companies have propriatary rights to what their employees develop while in their employ.
An example, my father had a number of patents for fuzing and projectile development for air dropped munitions. He got paid $1 for each patent by his employer. That was it. They owned the rights lock stock and barrel. But that was originally spelled out in his employment agreement, so he knew the score.
Please stay in touch with us as you have helped a lot of us, and let us know where you go.
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10 years 8 months ago #35067 by Libertarian623
Replied by Libertarian623 on topic to bring everybody up to speed... long read
Currently engineers mechanical ,electrical ,chemical all sign agreements with employers for a portion of the rights to the work they produce. I have a friend who's only 35yo and has over fifty patents to his name, he gets anywhere from 5-15% of the settled value in the future for them. He was layed off 2 years ago and has not needed to work since. He is a smart cookie and the exception not the rule. When you start your employment is the time to alter the standard agreement. He probably would not have fared so well had it not been for his father who had some knowledge of the practice.
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10 years 8 months ago #35072 by faawrenchbndr
Replied by faawrenchbndr on topic to bring everybody up to speed... long read
Wow,....what a load of bullshit!

I guess it is clear to see what direction the new owners are going to take.
Beginning of the end of Armalite as we know it.
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10 years 8 months ago #35075 by OleCowboy
Replied by OleCowboy on topic to bring everybody up to speed... long read

Libertarian623 wrote: Just ask Bill Gates , he took on IBM for DOS and won. He did this as a 18 yo if memory serves me correctly

Urban legends:

Bill, bought DOS from one of the guys he knew I think in his users group, IIRC he paid about $500 for it. Mom and Dad are high powered very wealthy, well connected corp lawyers. They managed and guided the show. IBM was looking for a op system to run there upcoming PeeCee's. IBM say little if any major market for the PC or its OS. (Shows how smart IBM was) as a result Bill retained rights and IIRC licensed the rights under IBM DOS. He also licensed the rights to others, but kept the original which he called MS DOS.

Genius, far from it.; The smartest guy is the computer business was Steve Jobs!
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10 years 8 months ago #35078 by jtallen83
Replied by jtallen83 on topic to bring everybody up to speed... long read
Seems ArmaLite isn't that concerned about customer care. I always thought your course was a sign they backed their product all the way. They don't seem to understand much of customer loyalty comes from the people, not products.
Bummer for things to end that way for you but I'm betting you'll land something better in the end,
very few will have the resume you do. :usa:
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10 years 8 months ago #35125 by mrraley
Replied by mrraley on topic to bring everybody up to speed... long read
What is really funny, is the company that they decided to have do the training now is the owners son's friend.

here is the kicker... the company also has on staff one of their competitors to teach another armorers course for POF.

So tell me if that's not letting company secrets out...

www.statraininggroup.com/

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