Muzzle Breaks

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15 years 5 months ago #1594 by BUILDING MY SASS
Replied by BUILDING MY SASS on topic Re:Muzzle Breaks
I also live in a free state (for now), and I intend to as soon as I have the extra 1K.
BMS

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15 years 5 months ago #1595 by a Guest
Replied by a Guest on topic Re:Muzzle Breaks
I am getting where I don't read those comic books anymore. 90% ink on paper and they will write anything to put beans on the table.Most are behind the curb. MSH

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15 years 5 months ago #1605 by Edge
Replied by Edge on topic Re:Muzzle Breaks
BUILDING MY SASS wrote:

You should get the magazine, I think you would like the article.
BMS


I do get that magazine. I think I remember looking at the article, but I didn't read it, because I've studied this out a few years ago and am happy with what I use now, so I skipped over it for the time being. I'll go back and read it. Like you said, ask 10 different people, you'll get 10 different answers. That's definately true with muzzle brakes. I would just stick with your birdcage for now, unless you're really serious about 3-gun games or something similar. For now, though, I don't think your going to gain that much.

MSH wrote:

am getting where I don't read those comic books anymore. 90% ink on paper and they will write anything to put beans on the table.Most are behind the curb. MSH


I'm getting to where I'm the same way. The only rag that I really like anymore is Precision Shooting. Not much BS in that magazine.

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15 years 5 months ago #1606 by BUILDING MY SASS
Replied by BUILDING MY SASS on topic Re:Muzzle Breaks
Like you said, I think I'll save the money for some thing else, and beside never know when it might actually be needed, honestly, I'll wait for the suppressor package.
On the magazines, I'm starting to get that way with some, I read Special Weapons by the Harris Publications Co. they also have several other mags out to, any way they are starting to swap articles between their magazine and issues, what a bunch of crap. Maybe I should sell them mine (hahaha).
Anyway I will stay with the Bird cage "for now". On a different note that's up your alley, my youngest is looking at getting a .308 bolt, dam I'm a proud papa.
BMS

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15 years 5 months ago #1608 by a Guest
Replied by a Guest on topic Re:Muzzle Breaks
If its enough of us out here now mabe we can start telling lies about a hot night in Havana and sale the stories for big money. Hemmingway got away with it. Jr. Samples had a fish story. It seems that alot of gun magizines have swaped articals for years. Bottom what works for you is good enough.MSH

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15 years 5 months ago - 15 years 5 months ago #1610 by crux
Replied by crux on topic Re:Muzzle Breaks
My personal experience is with a factory full length Super SASS suppressed, unsuppressed, and my reformed SASS 16" upper (adjustable gas system removed/replaced) that has the PWS FSC30 mounted. I can speak to compensation effects in general but I have no experience with non-factory flash hiders for comparison.


Recoil:
The recoil reduction going from the Super Sass to the 16" with FSC30 was noticeable. The Super SASS had what I'd subjectively say a "slight" kick to it (I define "significant kick" in terms of my full length M91/30 Mosin Nagant). The 16" with FSC30 had "recoil" but no noticeable "kick". And really the only difference being one rifle delivered a momentary but inconsequential feeling of pain, the other delivers no noticeable sensation of pain.

I've had about 5 other people try the 16" with FSC30 and all agreed that the recoil reduction was significant, dropping it to less than my AK, and perhaps on par with a full size AR-15.

Accuracy:
I've tested the 16" to 100 yards and it delivered sub MOA accuracy while strapped down (my skill can't approach that performance with the EOTech currently mounted). It does not appear to reduce the raw performance of the rifle (Black Hills moly coat 168grain). The rifle doesn't hop much, but it also has a match barrel and aluminum quad rail, so it's a bit heavy to begin with and naturally resists recoil effects more than a lighter rig. In tactical matches I would say it generally stays well on target between shots (see caveat in Blast commentary), but I only have an experience with an uncompensated AK for comparison in standing/moving operation. (The uncompensated SASS was on a bench with a bipod, very different circumstance)

Blast:
The FSC 30 does produce an increased blast. It's not debilitating but takes getting used to. One of my associates commented that it psyched him out. The pressure wave made him blink/cringe, and he expected to absorb some massive recoil on account of the sound, but the rifle just sat there delivering no significant recoil. The blast made him flinch basically. This more than anything seems to me would be the concern for accuracy, and you would have to condition yourself to the blast to ensure you didn't react to it in a way that reduced your accuracy. The blast was also noticeable during a rifle match. Not so much that people decided to move away, but it was compared in noise level to a short barrel M4 variant that one of the U.S. marshals carried.
A significant concern in my mind is the effect of the redirected blast on dust/debris kick-up. I have a compensated AK-47 that is relatively stable on recoil, but when fired in low-to-the-ground/off-pavement situations definitely kicks up more dust. I have not tested this effect with this 16" but I expect it will be more pronounced. Having a rifle that stays neatly on target is not so useful when it creates a dust screen obscuring the target, so this is something to definitely pay attention to. I intend to try and assess with the 16" soon at a tactical rifle match, and will try to remember to post the results back on this thread.

The Suppressor Option:
Contrast all this to the Super SASS under Suppressed operation. The recoil on the super SASS was reduced with the suppressor, but not as much as the FSC 30 to my personal subjective feeling (still, we're talking a relatively mild recoil to begin with). There was however no blast effect, and the noise was of course reduced compared to unsuppressed operation. It was by no means "silent" however. If I had the spare cash for an AAC SCAR-H SD with M.I.T.E.R. I'd be tempted to go with a suppressor, but for now I find it personally cost prohibitive.

Wrapup:
For practical consideration, as has been mentioned, one needs to determine where this data falls in to personal requirements. Balance between recoil reduction, stability, and blast effects will be a personal choice that needs to be dialed in. I personally wouldn't see much value in a compensator for just bench shooting, but I feel the stability did help me in a match for a fast reaction time multiple target course of fire (12 close-in targets had to be engaged with high precision in a very short time window). My personal choice was also highly driven by consideration for the wife's low tolerance for recoil. For others I would expect the added noise signature / debris kick-up of a compensator might not be worth the recoil reduction/stability. But like I said, I think it's something highly driven by personal requirements. I'm happy with the FSC30, but if I could excuse the expenditure I'd probably opt for a suppressor.

Hope that's useful.
Last edit: 15 years 5 months ago by crux.

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15 years 5 months ago - 15 years 5 months ago #1611 by crux
Replied by crux on topic Re:Muzzle Breaks
MSH wrote:

I am getting where I don't read those comic books anymore. 90% ink on paper and they will write anything to put beans on the table.Most are behind the curb. MSH


Heh, I had always seen those things on shelves but never read them really. When I was researching for my AR-10 build I cracked open a few of those (and their online versions) and was dismayed about how little information was there that I hadn't already uncovered in more detail elsewhere. "What's the point of these?" I asked myself, especially as the commentary frequently seemed to put a "halo" on whatever was being reviewed (Everything out there is great really!).

Come to that, that's how I feel about most magazines anyway. Generally superficial, and not a trustworthy source for real information.
Last edit: 15 years 5 months ago by crux.

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15 years 5 months ago #1613 by BUILDING MY SASS
Replied by BUILDING MY SASS on topic Re:Muzzle Breaks
Yes it is helpful, I'll probably have to read it a couple of time to get it all to sink in (chuckle) thanks.

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15 years 5 months ago #1614 by BUILDING MY SASS
Replied by BUILDING MY SASS on topic Re:Muzzle Breaks
I appreciate it, Thank you.

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15 years 5 months ago #1615 by BUILDING MY SASS
Replied by BUILDING MY SASS on topic Re:Muzzle Breaks
"seemed to put a "halo" on whatever was being reviewed (Everything out there is great really!)." I have to agree with you on that. I usually use them as a starting point to find out information from other sources, case in point, this discussion, but by no means do I use them as a "bible" so to speak. What is really humorous about them, is when different mags do articles on the same item (guns mainly), it can really get interesting as to the points of view and how they say the same thing but opposite one another, and sometime even conflict each other.
So I buy them for the pictures and adds, hahahaha.
BMS

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